I want to hear the theories that you gotta stretch before you reach for, but that you still genuinely believe and are willing to defend.

  • DetroitLionsSBChamps@alien.topB
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    1 year ago

    It’s objectively worse ending from the point of view of the show. What the show sets up, the themes it introduces and hammers over and over. Death is cheap and easy. Living is complex and nuanced. That’s what the show is.

    If Bojack dies we weaken the themes of redemption, consequences and accountability, continued struggle, and hope.

    If you want to believe he died, sure. But literally it isn’t what happened in the show (as we very clearly see) and it would be a worse ending. So I’m not sure why you would choose to decide for yourself that what you saw with your own eyes wasn’t real, and invent a worse ending overall

    • AStreetcarNamedJim@alien.topB
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      1 year ago

      Yeah, this is the emotional backlash I’m talking about. Themes of redemption? We must not have watched the same show. BoJack hurts people in all sorts of horrible ways (Sarah Lynn, Penny, and Gina are the most extreme examples), destroys his closest friendships, tries to kill himself at least two times (and dreams about killing himself when he gets old), and ends up relapsing again. And what do you think about all of the lines about life not getting better? Do those just not count because you don’t like them?

      I don’t know how to be, Diane. It doesn’t get better and it doesn’t get easier. I can’t keep lying to myself, saying “I’m gonna change.” I’m poison. I come from poison. I have poison inside me, and I destroy everything I touch. That’s my legacy. I have nothing to show for the life that I’ve lived, and I have nobody in my life who’s better off for having known me.

      I guess my question is, do you…do you think it’s too late for me? I mean, am I just doomed to be the person that I am? The person in that book? It’s not too late for me, is it? It’s It’s not too late, Diane, I need you to tell me that it’s not too late. I I need you to tell me that I’m a good person. I know that I can be selfish and narcissistic and self-destructive, but underneath all that, deep down, I’m a good person, and I need you to tell me that I’m good, Diane. Tell me, please, Diane. Tell me that I’m good.
      [silence]

      Suddenly, you realize you’ll never have the good relationship you wanted, and as long as they were alive, even though you’d never admit it, part of you, the stupidest goddamn part of you, was still holding on to that chance. And you didn’t even realize it until that chance went away. “My mother is dead, and everything is worse now.” Because now I know I will never have a mother who looks at me from across a room and says, “BoJack Horseman, I see you.” But I guess it’s good to know. It’s good to know that there is nobody looking out for me, that there never was, and there never will be.

      People don’t change, Diane, not really. We’re Zoes, Diane. We’re cynical and we’re sad and we’re mean. There’s a darkness inside you, and you can bury it deep in burritos as big as your head, but someday soon, that darkness is gonna come out, and when it does, I want you to call me.

      I’m not gonna give you closure. You don’t get that. You have to live with the shitty thing you did for the rest of your life. You have to know that it’s never, ever going to be okay.

      You’re wearing some awfully heavy blinders if you think this is simply a show about redemption and not someone continuing to fuck up his own and others’ lives. If you want to address what I actually said, then I’ll hear it, but I can tell you’re emotionally invested in one particular ending and don’t want to see any alternatives.