You realize that after a few Japanese classes. The language has a grammar that is completely different to English. Most languages we are familiar with have a Subject-verb-object order (SVO). The cat eats a mouse. Even Chinese follows this structure, from what I’ve been told. While Japanese is a Subject-object-verb (SOV) language. The cat a mouse eats. A bit like Yoda speak. This forces the translator to restructure the sentence so much of the writing style is the translator’s job.
It feels cringe because you’re not used to the cultural context. This kind of honorifics are everywhere in Japanese society. I think that if the intended audience is familiar to those quirks it’s better to keep it literal. And if not, the localization should mostly ignore the honorifics because they’re often impossible to translate them in an acceptable way.
There’s an interesting example. There’s a novel from one of the best Japanese writers (Natsume Soseki) called Wagahai wa neko de aru, which is normally translated as “I am a cat”.
The thing is that the protagonist cat refers to himself all the time as “Wahagai”, which is a very archaic and pompous way to refer to oneself. Maybe the closest thing here would be the majestic plural, the speech where a king speaks as “We/Us” rather than “I/me”.
It’s a difficult thing to convey because in the original the damn cat speaks about itself as if he were a noble or something, to a comedic effect. And in the translations I read this is lost.
And it’s not even unique to Japanese. Some languages that are way closer to English have honorifics that are very difficult to translate.
Spanish has a formal (usted) and informal you (tu). And its usage varies wildly across dialects, in European Spanish it’s barely used because it feels too uptight and archaic. Not even teachers are addressed this way nowadays. Meanwhile, in some places in Latin America it’s not uncommon to use the formal talking with your mother. And there’s also Argentina/Chile/Uruguay which has a whole different system.
English had a similar system in old times (you/thou). But it later shifted to exclusively using the formal “you”.
That’s my opinion too. Besides, sama is literally untranslatable. You could use “lord” but it doesn’t fit at all because most of the times you’ll be addressed in extre polite jargon like this in restaurants and hotels.
I think that if AI became genuinely as good as a human writer at creating original interesting stories, we would probably be dealing with such a deep intelligence that it could be argued that it deserves being treated as a human rather than a machine. It all depends on what you consider being human means.
Idk if this will ever be possible. For now, AI is at most a glorified parrot, and I’m probably downplaying parrots here. It’s really hyped up because there’s a ton of people salivating while thinking how to make a quick buck with even more automation.
I see how it can feel too confrontational, but the points they raised are valid. And they haven’t said you’re bad for enjoying the books or anything like that ffs. The reaction has been so bad it basically proves them right more than wrong. I have nothing against HP or the fan base but there are some irrational fans.
I agree with most of your points, OP. In fact, I think many of your criticisms were pointed out by Lindsay Ellis or Shawn on YouTube. You could check them out if you haven’t, I think you’ll like them.
I’m pretty amazed at how negative the reaction has been. It seems like you’ve touched a nerve here, because it’s not like you said anything that was that controversial really. I guess you’ve committed the terrible crime of analysing the dearest book of many people.
I think it’s very ironic that people from a literature subreddit can’t manage to understand that criticism of the contents of the book is not the same as banning a book, or banning you reading that book, or making you feel bad for enjoying that book. I honestly think at times that some people have developed an unhealthy attachment to HP. It’s perfectly ok to enjoy them. I know people who reread the series every year and are perfectly aware of the valid criticisms of the book.
I mean, Dostoevsky is one of my favorite writers, and I remember that one of the notes from the Karamazov Brothers edition I read specifically mentioned that he was an antisemite, and I’m pretty sure that someone who decides to translate an 800 page novel has some appreciation for the work. It’s part of becoming an adult to understand that the people you admire are not perfect, and sometimes they even suck. And yes, sometimes their personality transpires their work.
A similar thing happened recently in my country when a Twitter drama started when people questioned the way many females are represented in the videogame Metal Gear Solid series. I think most of the criticisms were reasonable, and I know for a fact that they came from some of the biggest fans.
I’m sorry you received so much backslash from rabid fans. I didn’t expect such a reaction from this sub. Honestly disappointed at how bad they’re being rational and critical thinkers.
Some are very difficult. In any romantic setting dropping the honorifics would be a huge deal because it implies a very intimate register, and it’s basically impossible to replicate if you don’t use them to start with.