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bojack did a lot of bad things and was not a good person but… the penny thing is not the worst thing he’s done. he told her no. several times. she kept pressuring and begging him and he said no even though she was of the legal age of consent. he was upset and thought about doing it but in the end when charlotte walked in he didnt so no harm no foul? ik this is controversial but thats what this post asked for so
She was not the age of consent
Actually she was, 17 is the age of consent in New Mexico. I think the show even specifically mentioned that
yes she was they mention that multiple times
Honeydew isn’t that bad.
fresh honeydew is the best way to have it
Bojack agrees with you in the last episode and that shows he truly has changed
BoJack is not a horrible piece of shit
I actually think Paige Sinclair was really fun, and I enjoyed the dynamic between her and Max. I wouldn’t have wanted more of them, but I thought they were around for the right amount of time.
Same!
After finding out Max was Schmitt from New Girl made it better for me
And the way they actually tie into the storyline was actually very smart. Very briefly but so profoundly.
I’m having a total brain fart. Who?!
I liked them fine, they just always felt like a joke I was quite getting, like a reference I didn’t know.
I think it’s hard to accept them for how out of the left field they seem. I genuinely thought I was in another flashback when I first saw them!
PC should have married Ralph.
I think it’s a reasonable want that the show knows about. But the plot point of having someone that it would’ve worked out with go by because of wrong place, wrong time is a difficult concept to represent, and the plotline explores that concept well.
mr peanutbuttwr isnt that bad
He’s flawed, but most people are, he’s not as evil as people on this sub make him out to be tho. In general, he has good intentions.
He is a huge narcissist. He usually only thinks about himself and is kinda the kind of guy that makes you say sorry when he does something wrong. For instance literally every instance with Diane he rarely ever thought about what she wants, all throughout their relationship he had a shitty reality tv show in the house when she just wanted privacy to write a book, he listened to his fans instead of his fiancé/wife, and he disrespected all of her boundaries and thoughts. And that is just Diane. There is so many other people he has hurt. Is he worse than Bojack, not really but they are two sides of the same coin.
He’s BoJack’s most loyal friend!
Todd really shouldn’t have flipped out over BoJack and Emily banging
It’s all cool when he’s responsible for the deaths of countless people though, and he truly doesn’t seem to care at all even if he didn’t do it intentionally.
It was less the fact that they banged and more that both of them had sex with eachother because they thought it would hurt Todd.
What? Bojack literally says “I was lonely, she was there, why does anyone have sex with anybody?”
Neither of them were trying to hurt Todd at all.
The episode made it clear that Bojack had sex with Emily because things were going well with Todd, and so he acted out and did something specifically so that he could damage his relationship with Todd, so that when his relationship eventually falls apart (because Bojack feels that every relationship he is in falls apart) he can look back to the bad thing he did to Todd and blame that for why Todd left him, not because Bojack is inherently poison that drives people away.
I dunno the way I think about it is it’s a breach of trust in a friendship, and as others have said the “last straw” for Todd. The act itself isn’t that bad, they are two consenting adults who had sex with each.
But this was Todd’s closest and longest standing friend. Bojack could have sex with literally anybody else, but chooses to do it with someone that Todd clearly has close emotional ties too. Then it’s the fact that they lied after-like if it wasn’t a shitty thing to do that they knew would hurt Todd, why lie/cover it up? Also to add on to it Emily’s guilt made their relationship strain and she sort of exited Todd’s life (not permanently) at the moment, and he was super stoked to have that relationship again. While that was Emily’s choice, Bojacks actions played definite role.
And as far as the last straw goes, Todd had been processing all the shitty things Bojack had done to him since he found out about the rock opera, and while this under other circumstance may not have ended this this was it for Todd. And in my opinion justly so.
Bojack didn’t know that Todd was asexual yet. After everything bojack has done and Todd saw him do, it was just another sign that bojack did whatever he wanted regardless of consequences. And Todd at this time still liked Emily even if he didn’t want sex so it’s still betrayal.
Also Bojack did other things that led up to Todd lashing out.
“You can’t keep doing shitty things” is about the past, not just Emily.
Underwater episode is shit
All of these are weak. That said, everything about Penny has been blown waaaay out of proportion on every regard
People shouldn’t take the things that are clearly meant to be stupid jokes, seriously. The amount of people that argue Todd is the worst character because he caused a “genocide” or “killed a bunch of people with his theme park” is ridiculous. It makes me wonder if media literacy or common sense is a thing where people can’t differentiate between the serious topics and the wacky side-stories
i don’t think any one died from the themepark tho to my surprise
I dislike Todd because he isn’t funny. His story lines could be written by an elementary school kid. They’re insanely dumb and poorly written. Come on. Clown dentists? Accidentally tipped the waitress millions? I roll my eyes at every Todd story line. Like you couldn’t come up with a better character for Aaron Paul to voice?
Typical Todd story line: “What if it’s a WW2 movie BUT the Nazis are light bulbs and the Americans are BEER BOTTLES” Todd then gets 10 million for the idea. Todd then proceeds to leave the check in his jeans, the check gets destroyed in the washer and Todd giggles about it. Or Todd gets stuck in an elevator and they play that out for a few episodes, randomly cutting to him clicking the service button “WHY ISN’T SOMEONE COMING FOR ME”.
I hate characters in all shows whose sole personality is just being dumb. I guess they made him an asexual to try to add “depth” to his character, but then they had a wacky typical Todd storyline where his GF family was hypersexualized and he was playing hide and go seek. Ugh…
Not just the simple jokes. There are many controversies in this sub. Every minutia is evaluated according to strict legal standards or the purest of moral standards.
Example: the recurring trope that Ana Spanakopita sexually assaulted BoJack. True, one can make the case. But we are talking about BoJack, who is shown to enjoy carefree debauchery, including sex. There is no power imbalance between Ana and BoJack. So, in the context of this story, it is fair game. They are all unkind, selfish and inconsiderate and playing by the same rules.
Free Churro is overrated.
I hate Todd.
Angela isn’t as bad as the fandom makes her out to be.
17 minutes ruined the moral complexity of Bojack and Sara Lynn’s relapse by designating that rather than two fucked up enablers making bad decisions, he literally killed her through his criminal negligence. Takes the conversation from exploring how he let things get so bad to “nah, he definitely killed her, right there, at the end”. Rest of the build up doesn’t really matter as a result, and it no longer speaks to the dynamics of spirals but instead frames it as though Bojack could have saved her at the end but didn’t.
It ruined the moral complexity because this incident isn’t only about abuse and bad decisions, it’s about Bojack’s questionable morality as a person. This whole show is based on a likable and relatable character making immoral decisions and therefore raising the question of good guy vs bad guy. This is also where Diane comes in with her perspective on this; that people are essentially neither good nor bad.
Yeah I think most people would agree with that. The 17 minutes doesn’t factor into the moral analysis of the episode because we don’t even find out for another 3 seasons.
It’s a retcon that hammers in an already established point that Bojack screwed up.
I like Pickles