no. herb made it very clear that what he could never forgive bojack for was that he abandoned him as a friend when he needed a friend most. reaching out sooner rather than later wouldn’t change that fact.
That depends on how many years sooner. A few years sooner no and then you’re right. Years sooner meaning close to the time it happened than yeah, according to Herb he would have forgiven him and welcomed his friendship.
All BoJack would have had to say is look man I really tried but that Angela had me by the balls. Which she did and Herb could understand that.
It was the loss of friendship and support Herb needed that was the real transgression. But it did deliberately show them becoming more distant as BoJack became an obnoxious star so they really weren’t that close at that point.
He might say that but realistically it really depends. If Bojack had more than one interaction with him and didn’t act like he was entitled to forgiveness, things may have gone differently.
I think timing is important, if BoJack reached out when Herb was first alone and needed someone then yeah I think Herb would have forgiven him. But the longer BoJack left it, the harder it was for Herb to accept an apology. And after a decade it was just never gonna happen.
Yeah, I think another big part of it is that Bojack waited until Herb was literally dying. Herb had it right when he said Bojack was only apologizing for himself, that he just wanted to make himself feel better about things.
Yeah, that’s definitely the biggest factor in my opinion. I think if Bojack had reached out before the cancer, Herb would have been more willing to accept an apology. It would have shown that Bojack actually felt remorse, not just because he felt guilty.
Seems like a question for Herb.
Depends. Herb specifically said his problem with Bojack was that he left Herb all alone after the scandal, not that Bojack stayed on the show. I think if Bojack reached out within a year or two, they could have at least been cordial.
Probably. Also his intent in rekindling was important. Herb saw the intention of bojack and didn’t want to allow him to use the reconciliation.
I think as long as Bojack would have accepted the lack of forgiveness on Herbs part, Herb would have been able to forgive BoJack even when he thought he was dying of cancer. But when BoJack couldn’t accept Herb not forgiving him, he showed that BoJack was still unable to center the pain of Herb above his own need to absolve his guilt.
That was exactly herbs point
Absolutely.
He says it himself, in the end. He wasn’t even that mad that Bojack had let him get fired. It’s show business, he understands. He’s mostly mad that Bojack never reached out afterwards. If Bojack had reached out, he would have forgave him easily.
I think they would have made up if it werent for the cancer. Herb felt as though Bojack only came to see him because he felt guilty that herb would die without their relationship getting closure. Which is definitely true. But herb thinks Bojack abandoned him, and what I think is more likely is that Bojack is so used to people rejecting/mistreating him for thr most minor infractions, he assumed Herb would be the same. He thought herb wouldn’t want to be his friend because hed be angry, so he avoided him out of respect or even awkwardness. Which is honestly a fair assessment. Bojack just didn’t understand that he was sad everyone abandoned him, not because he lost his job, but even so, Bojack thought it was about the job. But I think this would have come out sooner had they met before the cancer.
Definitely. If he didn’t wait til herb had cancer, maybe took like 1 year instead of 30.
I think it is insinuated that he would have. He just needed a friend, not to mention his oldest and best friend, to be there with him in his darkest moment. I think if BJ had reached out even 5-10 years later they could have worked things out, at least to be on polite speaking terms. BJ only showing up, tail between his legs, when Herb was on death’s door to absolve his own guilt for being a bad friend is the nail in the coffin.
This obviously depends on timing, but I think it is definitely likely Herb would eventually forgive Bojack. Not at first, but with time. Y’all remember the running monkey speech? One of the core themes of the show is that change doesn’t happen in one instance of great effort, rather, it happens over time when you “do it every day. (That’s the hard part.”).
If Bojack reached out years earlier, they probably would’ve had the same sort of interaction they did in the show, but Bojack would’ve had the opportunity to come back to Herb again and again and show how he’s changed over time. One afternoon was never going to be enough to undo the hurt, but the two clearly shared a deep friendship that they were able to slide right back in all those years later. Herb even said it himself, it wasn’t the betrayal, it was the abandonment.
Given time, Bojack would’ve gotten there. Whether he’d have the emotional capacity to take that kind of accountability and keep showing up is the real question. It’s something Season 6 Bojack was probably capable of, but he never gets the chance to try because of cancer, er, I mean the peanut truck accident.
If it was like, a YEAR or less afterwards then maybe. Once he got cancer it was too late.
I think a big part of why he doesn’t accept Bojack is the fact that he is dying and knows the only reason Bojack reached out is because of guilt and the fact that he is dying. Length of time definitely matters, but if Herb didn’t have cancer and Bojack had still reached out that long afterwards I think its possible something could have happened, but BJ would have still needed to make ammends.
Even after everything, I think Bojack and Herb could’ve had a friendship again if he kept visiting him. Like if he turned up again a week later and said “I’m sorry. Again. Of course you’ll never forgive me, but I did enjoy seeing you. Let’s do this more”. Then who knows, maybe after 6 months or so Herb may have genuinely forgave him.